“A positive outlook on suffering” – Interview with Kuritarvitaja

Tartu, Estonia. How much do we know in our latitudes about the extreme, punk, diy and underground scene in that place in the world? That’s right, zero or little more. That’s why when I came across Kuritarvitaja’s music, I did not hesitate to ask them for an interview. I was so curious to let them have a word about the Estonian scene and movement, the issues they deal with in their lyrics (very personal but at the same time with a strong social/political approach), but most of all the choice of their name, which, if translated in a hasty way could appear misleading and sketchy. But they took care of all doubts with the interesting answer given to the first question. Spending no more words, I leave you with the thoughts of Märt, Rauno, Nossu, Hardi and Mauri, who give us a positive outlook on suffering.

Hi guys, let’s start right away by addressing the issue of your name Kuritarvitaja, which translated badly from Estonian might confuse and annoy many people. Would you like to explain the meaning of this name and how the choice came about?

Märt: It can be translated in several ways, but we use tha name as in “abuser of substances”, substance abuse is something that, sadly, is quite common in both punk and metal scenes. Our old bass player came up with the name when we had just started and were still rehearsing in my old primary school and no one had any better ideas so it just stuck.

Rauno: If by “translated badly” you’re referring to the word “abuser”, then I would disagree – it’s a pretty excellent translation. As a happenstance of language, both “kuritarvitaja” and “abuser” are formed from terms that roughly mean “someone who uses badly”, and in both cases the word can be used to refer to either substance abuse or personal abuse – in other words, either the act of being toxic to oneself or being toxic to those around you. This symmetry of internal vs external toxicity is reflected in our recurring themes of depression (a suffering from within) and oppression (a suffering from without). In a way, the negative causes (both internal and external) create a feedback loop with the negative results (both internal and external), forming a never-ending spiral of suffering.

I mean, either that or we’re just a bunch of sadbois, who the fuck knows. I guess it’s just important to note that a lot of our stuff is about overcoming all of the negativity that the lyrics are highlighting. I would describe it as “a positive outlook on suffering” if the phrase “a positive outlook on suffering” wasn’t such a deeply horrifying string of words.

Another issue that I want to address right away because it immediately intrigued me is the choice to define your music as “abusecore”? What is behind a label like this? Would you like to tell us more about it?

Märt: Abusecore started as a joke, because nossu thought that it was funny how bands just add some gimmick and maybe breakdowns to their music and call it a new genre. But i started liking it, because no one really plays the kind of stuff we do in Estonia. So i thought that why not go with it.

nossu: The aforementioned joke got started because different venues couldn’t agree on what genre we classified as and we weren’t exactly sure about it either.

Rauno: My two cents – I’m a bit older than the rest of the guys and I still remember the wondrously cringy “coining a new genre because we use blond hairdye instead of black”-era of mid-2000s metal, so I’m just glad we’ve gone towards the (IMHO) much more descriptive “crust/sludgecore”.

Continuing to talk about music, you offer a mix of crust punk, grind sounds and forays into sludge territories. How did you approach these sounds? What bands have influenced your music? and why did you decide to play these genres specifically?

Märt: We just play what comes to mind and sounds good. We started as a hardcore punk band in 2017 and slowly developed into the aberrant creature we are now. Everyone has so different musical tastes, but some parts still overlap and that is what forms our music. For example, I’m mostly into black metal and blackened crust, also lots of deathcore, sludge metal and crust punk. Bands that have inspired and influenced me are Dystopia, Skitsystem, Lorna shore, Psychonaut 4 and lately Trespasser to name just a few.

Hardi: My main influences that have bled onto my own writings are Dystopia, Acid bath, Electric wizard and Soilent green, my playstyle is a blend of death metal and sludge with a hint of dynamics if the riff demands it.

Mauri: Haha, drummer goes brrrrrr. Breakdowns make me feel fuzzy inside. Main influences for me would be Motörhead, Dixie Dave bands, Acid Bath, Rotten Sound and a lot of other bands from Estonia and abroad.

nossu: A big part of our sound is just the HM2 chainsaw-like guitar distortion, making stuff overly noisy and ear piercing. It’s great for playing live, I can hide how shitty of a guitarist i am behind the muddy wall of noise, hehehe. I don’t tend to take myself very seriously either while writing or playing music. For me, the biggest influences have been Dystopia, Buzzoven and lately Nails.

Rauno: It’s just a love of grindy blastbeats and crusty d-beat riffs and sludgy breakdowns, combined with not having enough self-control to only choose one. If you want very specific influences, I’d mention “Self” by Rotten Sound for the grindy stuff (and the guitar tone), “Religion Is Fear” by Extreme Noise Terror for the crusty stuff, and “Broke Dick Dog” by a fantastic-but-very-difficult-to-google NY band called Architect for the sludgy breakdowns.

You come from Tartu, Estonia. Here in Italy we don’t really know anything about the Estonian underground, diy and hardcore punk scene, would you like to give us a brief overview of both what it’s like today and the past? What have been and still are the most active and important bands, gathering spaces, collectives in your city and in general in the Estonian scene?

Mauri: There used to be a huge punk and metal scene here, nowadays the underground scene in a lot less active, the people who have been in the scene for a long time, have grown up and there’s not that many new people coming in. Most important gathering places have been Kroksi club, Hell club and Pirogov park, most influential bands in my opinion have been Trachea, Sociasylum, Estoner, Kannabinõid, Huiabella Fantastica and so forth.

nossu: In Tallinn there’s Anemon12/Ylase12 social club and in the last few years a lot of new younger punks and bands have appeared. In comparison, Tartu’s scene is smaller. We had a similar growth of youngsters about 5 years ago but it has largely died down. People grow older and move on with their lives but there’s still active people in the scene. We usually have about 2-4 punk gigs every month in the DIY spaces, a lot of them with touring bands from Finland, Baltics and beyond. Outside of the two biggest cities there’s sadly a lot less happening. We have a problem with some older punks and metalheads being nazis as well.

Märt: Lately I’ve seen some new people at shows in Tartu too, so maybe it isn’t so hopeless (as i’ve been thinking for a long time) after all and Tartu scene revival is happening too.

What are the biggest difficulties in being a punk band in your country? And what does it mean for you to be and play punk in 2023? Does this music have a potential for threat and change nowadays in your opinion?

Mauri: Making money with our music, getting our expenses even. I don’t think it makes a difference what year it is, maybe lyrics adapt to problems in the world that have arisen in the past years. I think we’re gonna make even more complicated songs in the future.

Märt: Nowadays we’re really more of a metal band in my opinion. I’ve never called myself a punk, I like the culture, the scene and the solidarity and unity. The biggest difficulties are, as Mauri says, getting our expenses even. And just reaching outside of Estonia. We’re just a random tiny country in eastern Europe, bigger bands rarely visited Estonia in the past (but it seems like some interest towards playing here is growing) and even if they did, the shows were (and still are) in Tallinn only. So it was difficult to even get to play with bigger names to get your name out there with that, reaching somewhere on your own is almost impossible in such niche genres. I personally don’t care about threats, even if there were any, I’ll continue making music as long as I can. I view change as a positive thing, nothing good has ever come out of being stuck in the past and “traditions”.

Rauno: Punk, to me, is largely about (as Märt said) community, solidarity, and unity. I grew up with metal, not punk, but never really got along with that scene or the community – even the parts that weren’t racist or misogynist or otherwise anti-human were just horribly elitist. Much later, as an adult, I kind of found the punk scene in Tartu and immediately fell in love. It’s like one of those children’s toys where you’re supposed to put the correctly-shaped brick in the correctly-shaped hole: I immediately felt that I fit in just right and that I don’t have to try to change myself in order to do that. And that kind of ties into my opinions of whether or not punk has a potential for threat and change – to quote a Pat the Bunny song, “A punk rock song won’t ever change the world, but I can tell you about a couple that changed me.” 

Instead, what personal and socio-political events influence your music and lyrics? What messages are you trying to convey as a band?

Mauri: Political, mental and physical environment themes.

Märt: Literally everything. How I feel, what I see on the streets, in the news, around me and what I read. For me, negative emotions have always been the strongest ones so that’s probably why all the lyrics are focused on topics that evoke negative emotions. I want my lyrics and voice to carry some weight. If I’m not writing about a personal experience I want to make people think. Think about how they act or how others around them act, how fucked the world is and how messed up many aspects about our society, politics, governments and so on are. And sometimes even the personal stories can make you think more about others. Or if not anything else, maybe someone reads our lyrics and doesn’t feel like they are going through all that shit alone. 

nossu: On a personal level, mainly severe mental health problems, both mine own and of the people around me. On socio-political level, neo-liberal economic policy fucking over lower income people; the rise of neofascist/far-right populist and religious fundamentalist groups and the hate against women, LGBTQ+ people and various minority groups; Russian war of aggression in Ukraine and Putin’s imperialist ambitions; the inability of current political systems to deal with climate change.

Your last record was released in 2022, and you refer to depression in the title. There is often a very personal and introspective approach in your lyrics, and the theme of depression appears recurrent. How does this focus on such a sensitive topic as depression come about? Why did you choose a title like Descent into Depression? 

Märt: The title illustrates the lyrical themes and overall sound turning much darker and heavier than it used to be. I personally wouldn’t call depression a sensitive topic. We have a fucking crisis on our hands. More and more young people are depressed because of the state of the economy, the sense of hopelessness for the future, even the social conditioning. And depression is a common problem in the scene and definitely something that needs to be talked about. Not only the feelings, but also the coping mechanisms that people develop. That brings us back to the band name. Substance abuse is common amongst depressed people, most people have their poison(s) of choice to try to cope with something…

Mauri: yes.

Rauno: Living through a long and severe depression through my formative years is probably the most personality-defining experience I have, so it’s a subject that is always within easy reach for the songs I write lyrics about. “Sensitive topic” can refer to either a need to handle the topic carefully in public discourse, or the vulnerability of opening up about it – in the case of the first, I get a leg up simply because I’m talking about my  own lived experience; and in the case of the second, well, the act of living that experience has left me with a significantly deficient supply of fucks to give.

What are the upcoming plans for Kuritarvitaja? Are you planning a tour, some gigs or recording new material?

Mauri: We were supposed to take a break to focus on new songs but people like us for some reason and keep inviting us to concerts, a baltic tour is coming up aswell.

Märt: A baltic “tour” (two shows), definitely shows in Estonia. We have a few new songs that are waiting to be recorded and we have talked with some bands about some split album ideas, we’ll see what comes of that. 

Guys thank you so much for your answers, I leave this space for you to add anything else you think might be important and interesting to share with those who will read!

Mauri: Keep calm and don’t wash your kids.

Märt: Support each other, help youngsters coming into the scene, make it a safe and welcoming place. Make some good music, live it. And keep the nazi fucks and other bigots out.